'Wait Wait' for August 17, 2024: The Calm Before the Storm

This week, Wait Wait trains for the coming political season with some of our favorite guests!

Transcript

JENNIFER MILLS, BYLINE: The following program was taped in front of an audience of real, live people.

(SOUNDBITE OF MUSIC)

BILL KURTIS: From NPR and WBEZ, this is WAIT WAIT... DON'T TELL ME, the NPR news quiz. I'm the man who sounds like I'm 6 feet 2 inches of pure lung...

(LAUGHTER)

KURTIS: ...Bill Kurtis. And here is your host at the Studebaker Theater in downtown Chicago, Ill., Peter Sagal.

PETER SAGAL, HOST:

Thank you, Bill. Thanks, everybody. You're too kind.

(CHEERING)

SAGAL: So we are continuing our summer break this week in honor of President Joe Biden, who taught everyone that, sometimes, it's OK to sit back and let other people do the job.

(LAUGHTER)

KURTIS: Also in honor of Joe Biden, I got a completely new set of teeth.

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: And since we're thinking election thoughts, why not start with our talk last year with the woman who might have been president if Bill here hadn't found an old monkey's paw in 2015...

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: ...And wished for some new material from the next administration?

KURTIS: The lesson - when dealing with ancient demons, be specific.

(SOUNDBITE OF ARCHIVED NPR BROADCAST)

SAGAL: Our guest today is the former first lady of the United States, the former U.S. senator from New York, and secretary of state and the first woman to be nominated for president by a major party. She is the author of many books, including a memoir called "Living History," a thriller called "State Of Terror" and a horror story called "What Happened."

(LAUGHTER)

HILLARY CLINTON: Yes.

SAGAL: Hillary Rodham Clinton, welcome to WAIT, WAIT... DON'T TELL ME.

(CHEERING)

CLINTON: Thank you, Peter.

SAGAL: Thank you.

(CHEERING)

SAGAL: I got to tell you, they were excited to see me. Then I told them that you were going to be in the show, and I was completely forgotten, so...

(LAUGHTER)

CLINTON: Well, I've listened to your show for years, and you've got such an enthusiastic following, me included, so it's a real joy to be with you.

SAGAL: You are so kind. We understand that next week is a big deal. It is the second annual meeting of the Clinton Global Initiative since the pandemic, right? So you're getting people together.

CLINTON: Right, right. This was brought back after the pandemic because, you know, there's such a strong desire for people to try to be with each other again and come up with, you know, things to do that make a difference. And so whether it's, you know, climate resilience or getting clean water to people or helping in Ukraine - whatever, you know, your interest or your passion might be, there's going to be others who will share that. And you can come and be a part of it.

SAGAL: I - OK, thanks. I appreciate the invitation. I'll...

CLINTON: You're welcome.

SAGAL: ...Be there on Monday. OK.

JOSH GONDELMAN: Peter, you've got to go fix the Ukraine (laughter).

SAGAL: I know. I got to take care of that.

(LAUGHTER)

CLINTON: Yeah, Peter, we need you.

SAGAL: I know. Clearly. I go up to Zelenskyy - from one short Jewish comedian to another, let me tell you.

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: I want to - I really agree with something you said, which is that during the pandemic - after the pandemic, we all became so desperate to go out and be with people. I specifically would love to be with Matt Damon and the Pope, who will both be there...

CLINTON: Yes.

SAGAL: ...Next week. I am guessing that - yes, the panels, the charitable commitments, the ideas for fixing the world - that's great. But what really rocks about CGI is the parties, right?

CLINTON: Well, they're not bad. I mean...

SAGAL: Well, well...

(LAUGHTER)

CLINTON: ...You know, if you're going to be earnest and working hard all day, you deserve to blow off some steam.

SAGAL: I agree. And so, I mean, I'm just imagining it can be surreal - right? - with, like, Janet Yellen and the pope, say, comparing gowns. I mean, what is...

(LAUGHTER)

CLINTON: Well, you just never know what might happen. That's why you need to come.

SAGAL: Exactly. All right. I might leave right now.

FAITH SALIE: Secretary Clinton, this is Faith Salie. And I recently had the privilege of telling your husband this story, but I didn't get to tell you, and it's really about you. My 9-year-old daughter saw a picture of her grandmother with your husband. He clearly took the selfie 'cause she doesn't know how. And my daughter said, who is that man with grandma? And I said, well, that's President Clinton. And she kind of cocked her head, and she said, you mean Hillary's husband?

(LAUGHTER)

SALIE: So I don't think you have to worry about the voters under 65.

(LAUGHTER)

CLINTON: That's funny. Thanks.

SAGAL: I...

SALIE: And your husband thought it was funny, too, to his credit.

CLINTON: To his credit - exactly.

GONDELMAN: Didn't think it was funny enough to pass it on to his wife, though. That's...

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: It is very strange - I will say this. It is strange talking to you because, obviously, you're a serious public figure who's done serious work, but you've also been this public icon for many, many years. You're a very, very well-known person, which shows up in different ways. So, for example, have you ever seen Pete Davidson's tattoo of you?

CLINTON: I have, yes.

SAGAL: You have?

CLINTON: (Laughter) Yes, I have.

SAGAL: So wait a minute.

CLINTON: Not in...

SALIE: In person?

CLINTON: ...The same way other women have seen it.

SAGAL: I was about to say.

DULCE SLOAN: Yeah.

(LAUGHTER)

GONDELMAN: You've seen pictures.

SAGAL: You've seen - so I - did...

CLINTON: No, no, no.

SAGAL: No?

CLINTON: I was with Pete. And, you know, then he...

SAGAL: Socially.

CLINTON: ...He lifted up his pants leg, and he showed it to me. And I was a little bit worried when he said that he was going to start removing his tattoos. But I saw him later, and he assured me that one would stay, so I hope it's still there.

SAGAL: That...

GONDELMAN: How often do you hang out with Pete Davidson?

(LAUGHTER)

CLINTON: You know, I am a big fan of Pete's. When I did "Saturday Night Live" years ago, I got to meet Pete and Colin Jost, and I really was very touched by both of them because, you know, Pete's father was a firefighter who died on 9/11. And, you know, Colin's family was very much involved with the New York Fire Department, and I did a lot of work with them after 9/11. So I really felt a connection. And I find Pete to be a - you know, a very appealing guy. And I just wish him the best. I mean, I really hope that, you know, he has a great life because he deserves it.

(APPLAUSE)

SAGAL: Wow. Get a tattoo of her on your leg, she'll say nice things about you. OK.

(LAUGHTER)

CLINTON: I will.

SAGAL: I just took a note.

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: Well, Secretary Clinton, I cannot tell you how exciting it is to talk to you, but we have asked you here to play a game that we're calling...

KURTIS: You can do anything with CGI.

SAGAL: You were part of one CGI, the Clinton Global Initiative, so we thought we'd ask you about another CGI. That is computer-generated imagery. That's quite popular in the moving pictures these days.

SAGAL: So just answer 2 out of 3 questions about the CGI - you will win our prize for one of our listeners, the voice of anyone they might choose on their answering machine. Bill, who is Secretary Clinton playing for?

KURTIS: Forbes Fox (ph) of Wilmington, N.C.

(APPLAUSE)

SAGAL: Forbes Fox - and I don't know how competitive you are with your husband, and I mean that honestly. But I will point out when he was in the show some years ago, he got all three right. I'm just saying that.

(LAUGHTER)

CLINTON: Oh, I've heard that, Peter.

SAGAL: Have you?

CLINTON: I've heard that, like, every year.

GONDELMAN: Oh, so that he told you. OK.

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: All right. Here's your first question. CGI is often used in big comic-book movies like "Blade Trinity." In that movie, CGI was used to create the illusion that the lead actor, Wesley Snipes, was doing what? A, paying his taxes...

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: ...B, saying the lines in the script rather than what he wanted to say; or C, keeping his eyes open?

CLINTON: Oh, my God. Oh, wow. Keeping his eyes open.

SAGAL: That's right.

(SOUNDBITE OF BELL)

SAGAL: What happened...

(APPLAUSE)

SAGAL: ...Was that the moment in the movie called for him suddenly opening his eyes to prove he was alive or something. And on that day on the set, Mr. Snipes was very angry at the director and refused to do it.

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: So they said, what the heck? And they just used CGI to put eyeballs on his eyelids.

(LAUGHTER)

CLINTON: That is hilarious. I - but I knew nobody in an action movie pays their taxes.

SAGAL: That's true.

(LAUGHTER)

CLINTON: So I knew that was not the answer.

GONDELMAN: I just pictured him getting so into it that he closed his eyes like a drummer and was just, like, really vibing.

CLINTON: (Laughter).

SAGAL: All right. Next question.

SLOAN: Petty queen.

SAGAL: Steven Seagal has continued his career as an action hero into the fourth decade, but there are some things, well, he just can't do anymore. In a recent film, they used CGI to depict him doing what difficult stunt? A, walking...

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: ...B, treating the other actors with respect...

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: ...Or C, performing a triple axel in pairs figure skating?

(LAUGHTER)

CLINTON: Oh, my God. Oh, walking.

SAGAL: Yeah. It was A.

(SOUNDBITE OF BELL)

SAGAL: Yes, walking. Now, to be fair, he wasn't just walking. He was also pointing his gun in various directions as he did it.

KURTIS: Yes.

SAGAL: Before we get to this last question, Secretary Clinton, you'll probably be thinking that after all of your achievements and prominence in public life, you cannot believe that you are being asked this kind of question.

SALIE: (Laughter).

SAGAL: And I just want you to know I share your disbelief.

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: Movies employ vast teams of CGI artists. Of course, you can see all their names in the credits. But one particular graphic artist working on the movie "Cats" was given a very specific job. What was it? A, matching the cast's movements as cats to footage of actual cats doing the same dance numbers; B, swapping out the animation on James Corden, who had accidentally been rendered throughout the movie as a dog; or C, removing all of the very anatomically correct CGI cat butts that a previous team had put on all the actors?

(LAUGHTER)

CLINTON: Well, it could have probably been all three of those, given how the movie turned out. But I think...

GONDELMAN: Wow.

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: You think you know, and the answer is...

CLINTON: I'm going to say the answer three.

SAGAL: That's right.

(SOUNDBITE OF BELL)

SAGAL: C. And somewhere out there, there is apparently a, quote, "butthole cut" of "Cats." Bill, how did Secretary Hillary Clinton do on our quiz?

KURTIS: She won them all.

SAGAL: Yay.

(CHEERING)

KURTIS: Good going, Hillary.

SLOAN: Does that mean I get to be the voice on Hillary Clinton's answering machine?

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: That's between you and the secretary, I'm afraid.

SLOAN: Hey, y'all, it's Hillary Clinton.

(LAUGHTER)

SLOAN: I'm not here right now.

CLINTON: I think that sounds pretty good.

SAGAL: Yeah. You could do a lot worse. The Clinton Global Initiative 2023 is taking place September 18 and 19. Secretary Hillary Rodham Clinton, thank you so much for joining us here on WAIT WAIT... DON'T TELL ME.

CLINTON: OK. Thank you, Peter.

SAGAL: Thank you, Hillary.

(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "SKIMBLESHANKS: THE RAILWAY CAT")

UNIDENTIFIED MUSICAL ARTISTS: (Singing) Skimbleshanks, the Railway Cat. The Cat...

SAGAL: When we come back, two of the most gorgeous movie stars in the world, Chris Pine and Zazie Beats, who are grateful to be on the radio so we can concentrate on their intellect - that's when we come back with more of WAIT WAIT... DON'T TELL ME from NPR.

KURTIS: From NPR and WBEZ Chicago, this is WAIT WAIT... DON'T TELL ME, the NPR news quiz. I'm Bill Kurtis, and here is your host at the Studebaker Theater in downtown Chicago, Ill., Peter Sagal.

SAGAL: Thank you, Bill.

(APPLAUSE)

SAGAL: This week, we are taking a well-deserved break in order to get ready to cover the stories that are coming our way this fall.

KURTIS: With my anchorman heritage, I can put my ear to the ground and hear the approach of a great stampede of news. We must prepare.

SAGAL: While we limber up, let's return to happy times and delightful people. In April of this year, we talked to Chris Pine, an actor who made his mark as a handsome prince in "Princess Diaries 2." But in his directorial debut, "Poolman," he depicted an eccentric obsessive, barely holding down that titular job. I asked him about moving to the other side of the camera.

(SOUNDBITE OF ARCHIVED NPR BROADCAST)

CHRIS PINE: Terrible. No, it was - I have to say, the directing and the acting of it - I don't know how it - people will view it, but certainly the experience of it was pretty joyful. And I had an incredible cast - Annette Bening and Danny DeVito and Jennifer Jason Leigh and a bunch of incredible people.

SAGAL: The movie is a lot of things, but it is also a kind of love letter to LA. Unlike a lot of people who do what you do, and therefore live there, you grew up there, right?

PINE: I grew up in LA. My father was on a really successful show in the late '70s and early '80s called "CHiPs," and right when I was born...

(CROSSTALK)

SAGAL: Oh, wow. Yeah.

(APPLAUSE)

SAGAL: Yeah, we know. We know.

PINE: Oh, yeah.

SAGAL: Oh, yeah. We were just - basically got you here so we could talk about your father.

(LAUGHTER)

PINE: Oh, I know.

SAGAL: We read - and I'm surprised if this is true, so I'm interested to see if you'll confirm it - that your father advised you not to go into the business.

PINE: My - you know, my father is a workaday actor. Like, he - when I was growing up, it was him going out on auditions all the time. And I think his advice was really born from - more than anything else - like, knowing just how difficult and how hard our business can be, what with rejection and the real possibility of struggling to make a living. So - but then I remember I went to - went - was at school, and I did a play. And my mother came up to me afterwards and looked at me very worriedly and said, are you sure you don't want to become a lawyer?

(LAUGHTER)

PINE: And I said, absolutely not. And she said, well, go with God.

SAGAL: Well, that's lovely. And so did - your first big movie role, as I understand it, was the male lead in "Princess Diaries 2: A (ph) Royal Engagement."

(CHEERING)

SAGAL: And...

PINE: Indeed.

SAGAL: ...This week, every woman I have met about 30 or below tells me that it was - that is the greatest movie ever made...

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: ...Or at least they thought so when they were in junior high. And I'm just wondering if that has been your experience of life - that women come up to you and go, oh, my God. When I was 13, you were just it.

PINE: I - so fortunate to have been given that opportunity by Garry Marshall. And I just wish for that role that I would have just had someone put hair gel...

(LAUGHTER)

PINE: ...On my head...

SAGAL: It is...

PINE: ....Because my hair is so...

(LAUGHTER)

PINE: ...Uncontrollably large in the film.

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: I noted that.

PINE: It's...

SAGAL: I watched it this week.

PINE: ...Brutal.

SAGAL: Yeah, it is a...

PINE: Why did you do that?

SAGAL: It's...

PINE: Why did you do that (laughter), you know?

SAGAL: I just assumed - because the movie is so perfectly calibrated to the tastes of young women that...

PINE: Except for my hair.

SAGAL: Well, I figured...

PINE: Yeah.

SAGAL: ...That's just what young women want. They want an incredibly handsome prince who seems, you know, a little dark and a little evil - but turns out to have a heart of gold - who has enormous hair. That was part of the whole thing.

(LAUGHTER)

PINE: Yeah.

SAGAL: So you went from "The Princess Diaries" eventually to playing Captain Kirk in the fabulous new rebooted "Star Trek" movies. So how much of your performance was based on William Shatner?

PINE: I think the biggest direction that J.J. ever had for me was, less Shatner.

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: Really? You were overdoing it?

PINE: Because it's so deliciously fun. I mean, anything from how he sits in the chair to how he does, like, a double take, there are many - the Shatnerisms (ph) are long and deep, and they're beautiful. They're beautifully crafted things so...

ADAM BURKE: There's a bit where you bite - you eat an apple. And I didn't realize that William Shatner ate apples in a certain way until you did it. And I was - oh, that's a Shatner apple eat.

SAGAL: A Shatner apple eat.

(LAUGHTER)

PINE: It's a Shatner apple eat. Yeah.

SAGAL: It's a Shapple. (ph).

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: I have to ask you one last thing before we get to the game, which is - I don't know if you are aware of this, but the celebrity magazines very much enjoy talking about the Hollywood Chrises. It's currently you, Mr. Hemsworth...

PINE: We talk about it on our WhatsApp chain, but - yeah.

SAGAL: Well, that's what I was going to ask.

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: So the Hollywood Chrises...

PINE: Yeah.

SAGAL: ...Are obviously Mr. Pine - with us now - Mr. Hemsworth, Mr. Evans and Mr. Pratt. And the question was, when you get together - and I imagine when that happens, it's called the full Topher (ph).

(LAUGHTER)

PINE: (Laughter) Whoa.

EMMY BLOTNICK: Not Christmas?

(LAUGHTER)

PINE: Whoa.

SAGAL: OK.

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: I feel topped.

(CHEERING)

PINE: Yeah.

SAGAL: I feel one - I feel one-upped.

(APPLAUSE)

SAGAL: Do you actually, like - because there are rankings. I don't know if you're aware of that. Like, who's the No. 1 Chris of the moment? And I was wondering if you guys worry about that.

PINE: It really depends on which clubhouse we're at.

SAGAL: Oh, sure.

(LAUGHTER)

PINE: But if we're in Los Angeles, I mean, you know, I think the current reading - I'm at least 48 points above the other guys, which is - look. That's this week.

SAGAL: Yeah.

PINE: Who knows what'll happen next...

(CROSSTALK)

SAGAL: Yeah. Let me just go through their IMDb. No, I don't see any writer-directors on there. So you take the cake, my friend.

PINE: Yep. There you go.

SAGAL: There you go.

(CHEERING)

PINE: I win.

SAGAL: You win.

(APPLAUSE)

SAGAL: Well, Chris Pine, we have invited you here to play a game that we are calling...

KURTIS: Ah, the scent of fresh, crisp pine.

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: Not only crisp pine...

PINE: All right.

SAGAL: ...But balsam, vanilla and clove. We're going to ask you three questions about, sir, air fresheners.

(LAUGHTER)

PINE: Ready to go. Let's do it.

SAGAL: All right. Answer two to three questions, and you'll win our prize for one of our listeners. Bill, who is Chris Pine playing for?

KURTIS: Chris Owens (ph) of Benkelman, Neb.

SAGAL: Another member of the Chris club. All right, here's your first question, Chris. While air fresheners help mask at least 30% of the smells in that cab you are now riding in, they can also cause a little bit of trouble, as in when which of these happened? A, a line of human-pheromone-scented fresheners called a spate of terrible marriages back in the 1990s; B, the pine-scented ones have been known to attract bears; or C, a school in Baltimore was evacuated and hazmat crews were called in thanks to the smell of a pumpkin spice air freshener.

PINE: B.

SAGAL: B - that the pine-scented ones attract bears?

PINE: Yes.

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: Which is why you see all those bears chasing the Ubers up and down the...

(LAUGHTER)

PINE: Exactly right. That happens in Los Angeles all the time.

SAGAL: That's absolutely true. That's how we get them out of the woods. No, I'm afraid it was actually C. The school in Baltimore had to be evacuated because of the overwhelming effect of the pumpkin spice air freshener. Nobody died. Five people did go to the hospital with pumpkin-spice-related trauma.

(LAUGHTER)

PINE: Jesus.

SAGAL: All right. It's not a problem. You have two more chances with...

PINE: Thanks, pal.

SAGAL: I know.

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: With the ubiquity of air fresheners, people are demanding changes to cope with them, such as which of these? A, Febreze being classified as a controlled substance by the federal government; B, an option in rideshare apps to request a car without them; or C, edible air fresheners to make your farts smell nice.

(LAUGHTER)

PINE: I desperately want to say C, but I'm pretty sure it's B.

SAGAL: It is B, yes.

(SOUNDBITE OF BELL)

PINE: Yes.

SAGAL: Many Uber - yes.

(APPLAUSE)

SAGAL: And apparently our audience agrees that Uber and Lyft should bring this to us, because many people would much prefer not to have that in their car. It makes some people...

PINE: It's the worst.

SAGAL: It's the worst. It makes some people very sick.

PINE: Yeah.

SAGAL: All right. It's just the worst. All right. Last one. If you get this right, you win. If you're putting on air freshener in your car, always use one of those little trees. Just do that so you don't end up like the man who used a spray and had what happen? A, he filled the car with so much aerosol air freshener that when he then lit a cigarette, his car exploded.

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: B, when it dried, it became opaque, and all of a sudden he couldn't see out the windows; or C, it was absorbed by his skin, and he spent the rest of his life smelling like cinnamon sugar.

(LAUGHTER)

PINE: Oh, God. One. One. One.

SAGAL: You're right. Yes.

(SOUNDBITE OF BELL)

PINE: Yes.

(APPLAUSE)

SAGAL: Yes.

OUTKAST: You made it. Terrific.

SAGAL: You got it, yes.

PINE: That fella was blown up.

SAGAL: This happened in the U.K. The - he lit a cigarette. The car - the - all the propellant or whatever, caught fire. The car windows were blown out. Nearby buildings were damaged. But amazingly, the driver himself had only minor injuries. I don't know how, but that's what happened. Bill, how did Chris Pine do on our quiz?

KURTIS: Two out of three. Wow, what a win, Chris.

(APPLAUSE)

KURTIS: Good luck.

SAGAL: Captain, my captain - well, Chris Pine is an actor, writer and director now. Chris Pine, what a joy to talk to you.

(APPLAUSE)

SAGAL: Thank you so much for joining us on WAIT WAIT... DON'T TELL ME.

PINE: Thanks, guys.

(CROSSTALK)

SAGAL: Hey, thank you. Take care.

KURTIS: Thanks, Chris.

PINE: Bye-bye.

KURTIS: See you.

(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "SO FRESH, SO CLEAN")

OUTKAST: (Singing) Ain't nobody dope as me. I'm dressed so fresh, so clean - so fresh and so clean, clean. Don't you think I'm so sexy? I'm dressed so fresh and clean.

SAGAL: In 2022, toward the end of the pandemic lockdown, we invited actor Zazie Beetz onto our Zoom call. Zazie starred in the acclaimed series "Atlanta" and also played a superhero in "Deadpool 2."

KURTIS: Mo Rocca, though, wanted to know about her origin story.

(SOUNDBITE OF ARCHIVED NPR BROADCAST)

MO ROCCA: Is it true that you got your acting superpowers at LaGuardia High, the school from "Fame"?

ZAZIE BEETZ: Yes.

ROCCA: I just have to say that for so many of us - you have to understand - like, growing up, it was, like, a fantasy if you lived outside of New York to be able to go to the "Fame" school, that high school.

BEETZ: It's so funny because honestly, it's like - it's a public school. Like, I don't know if people realize, like, it's - I don't know. I felt like, yes, it was this wonderful opportunity but also really just felt like school.

ROCCA: But it's not just school. They block off the traffic so that you can dance on top of taxicabs...

BEETZ: They did.

ROCCA: ...And stop traffic.

BEETZ: (Laughter) That's true. Don't all schools do that?

ROCCA: I mean, and you're dancing on the cafeteria table singing "Hot Lunch." I mean, it was impossibly exciting to watch that movie and TV series.

BEETZ: Well, you know, that's - I thought everybody had that, but I guess...

SAGAL: It's just strange. You have - you are known, I am told - and please correct me if I'm wrong...

BEETZ: OK.

SAGAL: ...For, like, making your own health products, like your own kombucha and body butter.

BEETZ: Yeah.

SAGAL: Is this true?

BEETZ: It's so funny. Like, I feel like that's totally become a thing that people ask me about all the time. I just do this at home, like, for fun. I mean, I used to do it to save money 'cause I was like, I want a face mask, but I'm not paying 20 bucks for that. And so I would just make my own stuff. And with the kombucha, I was just interested in that whole fermentation process. And then your SCOBY basically is like - it's like a pet. Like, you have to take care of it and...

SAGAL: Well, for people who don't know, tell everybody what a SCOBY is.

ROCCA: Yeah. What is a SCOBY?

BEETZ: So it's the - it's essentially the, like, bacteria that help - that create the environment that helps you...

ROCCA: It's the slime from which kombucha emerges.

SAGAL: Right. And - but...

BEETZ: Exactly. But it's actually - like, you can hold it. It's like a little...

HELEN HONG: It's like a sourdough starter, but...

BEETZ: Yes.

HONG: ...It's just way grosser.

BEETZ: Exactly. But you can hold it. And it's, like, a little Jell-O thing. And it's like, you have to take care of it, otherwise it dies.

SAGAL: Does yours have a name?

BEETZ: No, I didn't name mine, but she had many children because they keep making layers of new SCOBYs. And you can, like, separate them. And then sometimes, you have to throw some out.

SAGAL: Oh, my God. It's sitting in the corner of your room multiplying?

BEETZ: Yes.

HONG: Yes.

BEETZ: And it's - listen; I have a cat, and I had a SCOBY. I don't have a SCOBY anymore.

SAGAL: Do you ever hear it whispering things to you that maybe you don't want to do, but it really wants you to do?

HONG: (Laughter).

BEETZ: My SCOBY is a very positive SCOBY, so it only whispered...

ROCCA: Aw, he's a sweetie.

BEETZ: ...Kind and gentle things to me.

(LAUGHTER)

HONG: Oh, our - my sister's SCOBY tried to kill us in the night one time.

SAGAL: You see what I mean? I - hey, wait a minute. Here's a question. Since you were already into, like, making this disgusting goo for your friends, when the pandemic started, what new hobbies did you pick up?

BEETZ: What new hobbies - returning text messages. I started...

SAGAL: That's a good half hour every day.

HONG: Rocking in the fetal position.

BEETZ: Yes. I actually did - in two days...

SAGAL: Yes.

BEETZ: ...I went through 823 unread text messages.

SAGAL: Wow.

HONG: What?

SAGAL: Wow.

BEETZ: Yeah.

HONG: What?

BEETZ: Yeah, guys.

HONG: You were not up...

BEETZ: I wasn't kidding.

HONG: ...On your texts.

BEETZ: No.

SAGAL: I'm not as popular as you, so I don't have that much of a problem.

BEETZ: I don't...

SAGAL: But when I don't return texts for, say, a week, I just decide it's easier never to speak to that person ever again so they assume I'm dead - rather than having to apologize.

BEETZ: Yeah, that was my approach. And then I was, you know, so lonely...

SAGAL: Yes.

BEETZ: ...During the pandemic.

SAGAL: Well, I'm sure when you texted all your friends at last, your SCOBY was very proud of you.

BEETZ: Yeah, and a little jealous. She wanted the attention.

SAGAL: Of course. Of course. Well, Zazie Beetz, we are so delighted to talk to you, but we have asked you here to play a game that this time we're calling...

KURTIS: Zazie Beetz, Meet Sassy Beats.

BEETZ: Oh.

SAGAL: Specifically the beats of longtime Rolling Stones drummer Charlie Watts, who died last year at the ripe age of 80.

BEETZ: OK.

SAGAL: Answer two out of three questions about Charlie Watts, and you will win our prize for one of our listeners, the voice of their choice on their voicemail. Bill, who is Zazie playing for?

KURTIS: John Day (ph) of Durham, N.C.

SAGAL: I got to ask. Are you a Rolling Stones fan?

BEETZ: Not enough for this game.

SAGAL: OK. That's - as I often say, ignorance is often the best choice to go into this 'cause just a little knowledge will lead you astray.

BEETZ: (Laughter) Great.

SAGAL: All right. So here's your first question. Charlie Watts had some interesting habits while touring the world for decades with the Rolling Stones.

BEETZ: Yes.

SAGAL: He always did what? A, he saved all the underwear thrown at them on stage, resulting in a collection that filled an entire wing of his house; B, he sketched every single hotel bed he slept in; or C, he ate in alphabetical order, having apricots for one meal, beets for the next, et cetera - all the way around until he started again.

BEETZ: I hope it's the first one, but I think it's B.

SAGAL: You are right.

(SOUNDBITE OF BELL)

SAGAL: It is B. He sketched every single hotel bed he slept in. He had started as an artist, did some early album covers for the Stones. And I don't know why he did that. Next question - that was very good. Charlie Watts, like the other members of the Stones, liked to collect classic and expensive cars, but he did it his own way. How? A, he just collected the same car, the 1978 Dodge Aspen, until he had 106 of them; B, Watts never got his driver's license, so he just put on suits to match the car and sit in the cars in his garage; or C, whenever a bandmate bought a car, he'd get the Matchbox version and then brag about how much money he'd saved.

BEETZ: Oh, that's so sweet. I think it's A, though.

SAGAL: You think it's A, that he just collected 1978 Dodge Aspens.

BEETZ: Yes (laughter).

SAGAL: That's it. That was the only car he was interested in until he had 106 of these identical cars, presumably in different colors, at his estate.

BEETZ: Hopefully.

SAGAL: Yes. No, I'm afraid it was actually B. He never got his driver's license.

BEETZ: To be fair, I got my driver's license three years ago.

SAGAL: Well, you're a New Yorker, right?

ROCCA: That's a New Yorker. Yeah.

BEETZ: Yes.

SAGAL: Right, so that's a natural New York thing.

BEETZ: (Laughter).

SAGAL: Well, you have one more question. If you get this right...

BEETZ: OK.

SAGAL: ...You win. Once, while the Rolling Stones were on tour, Watts was woken in the middle of the night by a phone call from a very drunk Mick Jagger, demanding my drummer. How did Watts respond? A, he sent him 14 pound of chicken drumsticks via room service; B, he said, I'm sorry, I don't recognize your voice, sir; or C, he woke up, shaved, dressed in a suit and tie, put on some freshly shined shoes, went up to Jagger's room and punched him in the face, yelling, never call me your drummer again.

BEETZ: Ooh, spicy.

ROCCA: I really hope it's C (ph).

BEETZ: I like the spice. Let's go for C.

SAGAL: Oh, very good choice, Zazie. That's, in fact, what happened.

(SOUNDBITE OF BELL)

SAGAL: The story was prominently featured in all of his obits. And what happened then was after he had punched Jagger in the face and said that, he then yelled, and you're my singer, he said.

HONG: Wow.

BEETZ: Nice. There you go.

HONG: I love the fact that he shaved and put on a suit.

SAGAL: He was apparently a man who cared about such things.

BEETZ: He liked his suits.

SAGAL: He was - he cared about such things. He did. Bill, how did Zazie Beetz do on our quiz?

KURTIS: Two out of three, and she won.

BEETZ: Yay.

SAGAL: Zazie Beetz is starring in "Atlanta" on FX. Zazie Beetz, you are a delight. Thank you so much for joining us on WAIT WAIT... DON'T TELL ME.

BEETZ: Thank you so much. This was so fun.

SAGAL: Take care. Thank you, Zazie. Bye-bye.

BEETZ: Bye.

(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "PAPER BOI")

PAPER BOI: (Rapping) Paper Boi, Paper Boi, always about that paper, boy. If you ain't on your grind and you flexing, you's a hater, boy. Paper Boi, Paper Boi.

SAGAL: When we come back, the British actor who played America's greatest hero and a woman who became a TV star because selling weed in high school didn't work out. That's when we're back with more of WAIT WAIT... DON'T TELL ME from NPR.

(SOUNDBITE OF MUSIC)

KURTIS: From NPR and WBEZ Chicago, this is WAIT WAIT... DON'T TELL ME, the NPR news quiz. I'm Bill Kurtis, and here is your host at the Studebaker Theater in downtown Chicago, Ill., Peter Sagal.

SAGAL: Thank you, Bill.

(APPLAUSE)

SAGAL: So this week, all of us at the show are off at our summer bootcamp, which is like Navy SEAL training, except for dealing with the news.

KURTIS: Seventy-five percent of candidates wash out of the program, leaving only the best of the best to deal with the worst of the worst.

SAGAL: So while we get ready for the challenges to come, here are some older pleasures. In January of this year, we were joined by actor David Oyelowo, who had dozens of credits in his native U.K., but is most well-known in America for playing Dr. Martin Luther King in the movie "Selma."

KURTIS: Peter asked him if people here are surprised to find out he's actually British.

(SOUNDBITE OF ARCHIVED NPR BROADCAST)

DAVID OYELOWO: Very surprised, which is both a compliment and at times feels like I'm under threat because people feel quite upset about it. I remember doing a number of Q&As after we did "Selma" screenings, and African Americans particularly were like, man, you from Harlem. Come on, man.

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: I have other questions, but I'm sort of stunned by how good that was.

HONG: Yeah, that was...

SAGAL: That was really good. I wanted to talk a little bit about your background, which is fascinating to me 'cause I'm a theater guy. Is it true, the story we heard, that you first got into acting because you wanted to impress a girl?

OYELOWO: It's very true. It's very true. Theater was not something that was on my radar at all. What was on my radar was my pastor's daughter, who used to work the overhead projector at my church. And I was so obsessed with her, I never listened to a single sermon for an entire year. And one day, she asked me to the theater. I thought it was a date. It was actually to join a youth theater group. And I was so enamored with her that I kept going. And that's what led to me becoming an actor.

SAGAL: That is...

HONG: Whoa. Chasing the pastor's daughter?

(APPLAUSE)

KURTIS: (Laughter).

SALIE: That's the name of his memoir.

OYELOWO: Don't make it sound unholy.

(LAUGHTER)

OYELOWO: I wasn't trying to do anything nefarious. I just liked her.

SAGAL: And that was, like, 30 years ago. You think she's impressed yet?

(LAUGHTER)

OYELOWO: Oh, she's full of regret. She sees me in movies, and she's absolutely gutted.

SAGAL: Really?

(LAUGHTER)

OYELOWO: It's absolutely true. Every time I'm in a movie, I get a very sad email from her.

UNIDENTIFIED AUDIENCE: Aw.

SAGAL: That's a love language, I think.

HONG: I was going to say...

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: Do you - I mean, it's funny. I usually ask this question of athletes, but it just occurred to me I could ask it of you because of the story you just told. You stumbled into this. You hadn't wanted to do it, but there you were. Was there a moment when you first realized that you were quite good at it?

OYELOWO: Yes. Yes, there was a moment. I mean, you know, the first thing I did was being part of that youth group where I had followed that girl to. And the reaction afterwards was pretty eulogistic from everyone else. The unfortunate thing is it was offset by my mother, who could never quite draw the line between make-believe and reality and would just say, why were you kissing that girl? That is not your wife. That is not your girlfriend. Leave her alone.

(LAUGHTER)

OYELOWO: And she actually did that during the performance.

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: No.

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: That's when you said, I have to get into TV, where they don't allow anybody in.

(LAUGHTER)

OYELOWO: Exactly.

SAGAL: Imagine she shouted that at many screens. I want to get to your movie. The movie is called "Role Play," as people will find out when they watch it, which you should, because the key plot element is this married couple decides to do some roleplay to spice up their relationship.

SALIE: Love language.

SAGAL: Exactly.

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: And your character, ironically also named David, turns out not to be very good at that. How does a very good actor play a bad actor?

OYELOWO: (Laughter) Well, you tend to be around a lot of bad actors, and you're just doing an impersonation...

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: Oh, really? You're like, oh, that guy...

HONG: You just put it out there.

SAGAL: ...I was in repertory with - he sucked. I'll just do him.

(LAUGHTER)

OYELOWO: Yeah. You now have several actors I've worked with second-guessing their careers right now.

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: Well, it is absolutely lovely to have you with us, David. And we have asked you here today to play a game that we're calling...

KURTIS: (Singing) Rolling, Rolling, Rolling.

SAGAL: So your new movie, as we've discussed, is called "Role Play." So we thought we'd ask you about the other kind of roll play, games you play by rolling things. Answer 2 out of 3 questions correctly, and you will win our prize for one of our listeners. Bill, who is David Oyelowo playing for?

KURTIS: Chris Crigeen (ph) of Morristown, N.J.

SAGAL: All right.

(APPLAUSE)

SAGAL: Ready to do this?

OYELOWO: Very ready.

SAGAL: All right. One of the most popular rolling games is, of course, bowling. One of professional bowling's star athletes, Mike Machuga, is a two-time national champion, but he is perhaps most famous for his signature move as a bowler, which is what? A, the Machuga Chop, where he throws the bowling ball overhand, B, the Machuga Hop, a shot where his ball goes into the gutter, then bounces out to hit the pins, or C, the Machuga Flop, where he rolls the ball but doesn't let go of it and slides halfway down the lane on his stomach.

(LAUGHTER)

OYELOWO: I'm going to say B.

SAGAL: It was actually C, the Machuga Flop.

HONG: What?

SAGAL: He does this apparently to entertain the crowds because it turns out in bowling, if you don't let go of the ball, it's not a foul even if you've crossed the line. So he does this thing where he rolls it, doesn't let go, slides himself halfway down, gets a lot of applause, comes back and rolls. That's a thing he does.

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: Here's your next question. There is a sport called Zorbing where you climb inside this giant inflatable hamster ball and roll around. But just rolling around, not exciting for some people, which is why you can also do what? A, in San Francisco, you can Zorb down the famously crooked and very steep Lombard Street; B, in Florida, you can race other Zorbers through alligator-infested waters; or C, in the Rocky Mountains, you can try bungee Zorbing.

OYELOWO: I'm going to say...

UNIDENTIFIED AUDIENCE: B.

OYELOWO: ...C.

SALIE: David, have you heard of an American phenomenon called Florida Man?

OYELOWO: I'm going to say B.

SAGAL: There you go.

SALIE: Yay.

(APPLAUSE)

OYELOWO: (Laughter).

SAGAL: Yeah. It is Florida, so, of course, they climb into these things and then run as fast as they can in them across the alligator swamp.

All right. Last question - in France, as you might know, there's a - they have a version of lawn bowling or bocce they call petanque. And almost every petanque court throughout France has a statue or a picture of a woman named Fanny nearby. Why? A, per tradition, any team that gets shut out in the petanque match is required to get down on their knees and kiss Fanny's, well, fanny; B, it is an image of Fanny Merlanieux (ph), a 19th century wife from Lyon who invented the game to get her husband out of the house and stop annoying her; or C, it's just a coincidence - there happens to be a lot of pictures and sculptures in France of women named Fanny, and some of them are near petanque courts.

UNIDENTIFIED PERSON: A.

OYELOWO: I'm going to go with my friend who said A.

SAGAL: Right. Yes. That's correct.

(SOUNDBITE OF BELL)

SAGAL: To be shut out in a petanque match is called (speaking French) or being fanny. And you are required to kiss the fanny. And I should say, by the way, that in France, in French, fanny means fanny as the same it does in America, not what it means in Britain. Bill, how did David do on our quiz?

SAGAL: In the final tally, I think David's got all three.

(APPLAUSE)

SAGAL: Sure he did. Absolutely, he did. Well, David Oyelowo is starring in the new film "Role Play," currently streaming on Prime. David Oyelowo, thank you so much for joining us on WAIT WAIT... DON'T TELL ME. What an absolute pleasure to talk to you. Take care, sir.

OYELOWO: Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Bye-bye.

(SOUNDBITE OF MUSIC)

SAGAL: Finally, also in January, we spoke to one of the most distinctive actors around - Natasha Lyonne from "Russian Doll" and "Orange Is The New Black." I asked her if she was recognized more for her appearance or her voice.

(SOUNDBITE OF ARCHIVED NPR BROADCAST)

NATASHA LYONNE: You know, if I have straight hair, I can pretty much move through the city like, you know, it's not me. But then as soon as I talk, I'm [expletive].

SAGAL: Right, exactly.

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: And when people are, like, looking at you, like, my God, you're Natasha Lyonne, and then what do they tell you that they love most?

LYONNE: Oh, I guess - you know what I like the most? I don't know what they're necessarily saying. But what I like is a sort of like a little bit of a sly handshake on the street that keeps moving from a real New Yorker. Like, they give me a little hand movement. Or I like - I sort of like a deli interaction. I guess that's why I wrote it into, like, "Russian Doll." That's one of my favorite type of New York interactions. I mostly enjoy it in Manhattan on the move, I think.

SAGAL: Right. That's cool. I mean, one of the great things about New York as opposed to LA - in New York, they're all too cool to get excited when they see a celebrity. They just give you the hi sign (ph). Yeah, I know who you are. I'm not impressed.

LYONNE: Yeah, but it makes me feel like a real New Yorker - like, part New Yorker, part leprechaun. And I like that feeling.

SAGAL: I understand that. I found out some amazing things about you this week that I had not known, even though I was a fan. For example, I read that you were thrown out of your pretty prestigious school because you were, I think, selling pot. Is that right?

LYONNE: It's a rite of passage as a teenager.

SAGAL: Yeah, I understand.

LYONNE: It was a private school on the Upper East Side, and I was a scholarship kid, so I think I had a bit of a resentment. So I would get, you know, just whatever, a dime bag. And then I would go to the corner head shop, when there weren't as many of them, back in those days. And I'd buy, like, a little $2 pipe, and I'd put, like, a single hit of weed in it. But I'd smoke the green off it. I'd take the first hit.

SAGAL: Right.

LYONNE: I'd put that into a plastic bag, and then I would sell them the pipe and the single once-smoked hit, like, here you go.

MAZ JOBRANI: That's a good business.

SAGAL: So not - this is amazing. Not only were you selling pot...

BRIAN BABYLON: She was selling the experience.

SAGAL: Yeah. I understand. And then this is what I thought was the kicker. They threw you out, and then because you were, like, even then becoming a famous actor, you were on Letterman, and they wanted you to come back.

LYONNE: Yeah. Yeah, it's true. It was a scam.

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: So I have been watching episodes of your new show "Poker Face," which was created by Rian Johnson of "Knives Out" fame. And it is amazing, especially to someone of my age, because I grew up with "Columbo" and those TV shows. And I'm watching it, and I realized this about halfway into the first episode - you get to be Columbo, which has got to be the coolest thing ever. And I'm assuming you're enjoying it, doing it as much as I'm enjoying watching it, right?

LYONNE: Well, you know, Peter Falk is such a cutey.

SAGAL: Yes. And you look good in the trench coat, is what I'm saying.

LYONNE: Aww, thank you. The...

SAGAL: But first of all, did you grow up - because you're younger. Did you grow up with those shows, like those "McMillan And Wife" and the mysteries of the week where you had a detective who solved a new murder every week? Maybe "Murder, She Wrote" was a later but classic iteration of that.

LYONNE: I mean, I'm going to go ahead and say, no, not really. I...

(LAUGHTER)

BABYLON: Are you old?

JOBRANI: She's not that old, Peter.

SAGAL: She's not as old - I'm old. She's vibrant.

LYONNE: I come through - I come to my love of sort of Philip Marlowe-style characters, I guess, really through, you know, Altman's "The Long Goodbye" or even "Chinatown" or even books, you know, like John Fante and Raymond Chandler and just noir in general. And I think my love for Peter Falk is really from all the Cassavetes films or "Wings Of Desire," in a way. And of course, I'm - you know, I also - I do like that sort of character, you know, a great deal. And - but I would not say you necessarily want me on an actual murder scene. I'm not sure I could definitely crack the case. I have a measure of street smarts, though. That is true. And I definitely share with Charlie an obsession with a sort of John Lennon, just give me some truth.

SAGAL: The flipside of that, though, is could you get away with a murder?

LYONNE: Oh, that's a great question. You know, the few I've committed so far...

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: Yes. Apparently yes.

LYONNE: But, I mean, yeah, I'm fine. Here I am on NPR. No cops at my door.

SAGAL: Yeah.

LYONNE: So far, so good. And honestly, those people deserved to die. I don't want to name...

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: You know, I got to say, if they pissed you off, I can't blame you.

LYONNE: And thank you. And thank you.

SAGAL: Well, Natasha Lyonne, it is really a pleasure to talk to you after watching you for so long. But we have asked you here today to play a game we're calling...

KURTIS: Poking Faces.

SAGAL: So your new show, which we've been discussing, is called "Poker Face." We thought we'd ask you questions about poking faces - that is, Botox injections.

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: Answer two out of three questions correctly, you will win our prize for one of our listeners, the voice of anyone they might choose on their voicemail. Bill, who is the amazing Natasha Lyonne playing for?

KURTIS: Jeremy Noel (ph) of Chicago, Ill.

(APPLAUSE)

SAGAL: All right. You ready to do this?

LYONNE: Yes, dear.

SAGAL: OK. So Botox is a trade name for botulinum toxin. That is the substance that causes the disease botulism. But before it was called that, the disease was called what? A, sausage poisoning; B, Satan's musk; or C, Stewart.

(LAUGHTER)

LYONNE: Yeah. I guess - yeah - why not Satan's musk?

SAGAL: Satan's musk. No, it was actually sausage poisoning.

BABYLON: Yeah.

SAGAL: Yeah. Because botulism is a food disease, and it was first studied in Germany.

LYONNE: Oh, that makes so much more sense.

SAGAL: It does. It was first studied in Germany, and in Germany, they eat a lot of sausage.

LYONNE: OK. Well, I look forward to losing here.

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: No, no. You have two more chances. You have two more chances. And we're fans, and we'll help. All right. So botulism, or rather botulinum toxin, Botox, is approved, as we know, for clinical uses, but it is unique among medicine. Why? A, you need at least $1 million of life insurance to be allowed to open a bottle of it; B, instead of milliliters, it is measured in mouse units, or the amount of Botox needed to kill one mouse...

LYONNE: Whoa.

SAGAL: ...Or C, it can be used as legal tender in Palm Beach.

(LAUGHTER)

LYONNE: Kill a mouse.

SAGAL: The killing - it's, in fact, killing mouses. Yes.

(SOUNDBITE OF BELL)

SAGAL: Mice.

(APPLAUSE)

SAGAL: MUs, mouse units. That's how they measure it. It's such a toxic substance that that's how it is measured. So that's great. You have one more question. If you get this right, you win. Botox injections - in addition to their cosmetic effects - right? - it paralyzes your skin - it's been shown to have a positive side effect in addition to that. What is it? A, it makes your skin as hard as Pyrex, preventing facial injuries for people who topple over...

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: ...B, it can alleviate depression literally by turning your frown upside down...

(LAUGHTER)

SAGAL: ...Or C, because it makes you look younger, it improves your taste in music.

(LAUGHTER)

LYONNE: Turn your frown upside down.

SAGAL: That's it. That's exactly right.

(SOUNDBITE OF BELL)

JOBRANI: Wow.

SAGAL: Botox does have a proven antidepressant effect. And one of the theories as to why is it literally makes it harder to frown. Bill, How did Natasha Lyonne do in our quiz?

KURTIS: Two out of three. That is a win.

JOBRANI: She did it.

BABYLON: Oh, there you go.

JOBRANI: Yes.

(APPLAUSE)

SAGAL: Natasha Lyonne is the creator and star of the Emmy-nominated "Russian Doll." Her new show, "Poker Face," is streaming on Peacock now. Natasha Lyonne, thank you so much for joining us, and congratulations on an amazing television show. It's fabulous.

(APPLAUSE)

LYONNE: Bye, guys.

JOBRANI: Bye-bye.

SAGAL: Bye-bye. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.

View this story on npr.org

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