'On Becoming a Guinea' fowl is a surreal exploration of painful secrecy

Susan Chardy in On Becoming A Guinea Fowl.

Chibesa Mulumba / A24

You should watch the surreal new movie On Becoming a Guinea Fowl. It opens with a Zambian woman finding her uncle's body on the road. His death brings the family together from near and far, but also resurfaces old wounds — wounds the elders would much rather ignore. It's a powerful story about the silence that keeps families from breaking, but only in superficial ways, and with devastating consequences.

Transcript

AISHA HARRIS: A warning-- this episode contains discussion of sexual assault.

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HARRIS: The surreal new movie On Becoming a Guinea Fowl opens with a woman finding her uncle's body on the road. His death brings the family together from near and far, but also resurfaces old wounds, wounds the elders would much rather ignore. It's a powerful story about the silence that keeps families from breaking, but only in superficial ways and with devastating consequences. I'm Aisha Harris, and today we're talking about On Becoming a Guinea Fowl on Pop Culture Happy Hour from NPR.

HARRIS: Joining me today is the Philadelphia Inquirer's arts and entertainment editor and film critic Bedatri D. Choudhury. Hey, Bedatri.

BEDATRI CHOUDHURY: Hey, Aisha. I'm so glad to be here discussing this film.

HARRIS: Yes, me too. It's great to have you back. Also with us is writer, comedian, and co-host of the Bad Romance podcast, Jourdain Searles. Hey, Jourdain, welcome back to you.

JOURDAIN SEARLES: Hi! Happy to be back.

HARRIS: Yes. On Becoming a Guinea Fowl stars Susan Chardy as Shula, a Zambian woman who discovers the body of her dead Uncle Fred lying in the road late one night. As the family convenes for the morning rituals, Shula is forced to confront a traumatic past and, in the process, grows closer with her cousins. Tensions rise over several days as secrets are dragged into the light and aspersions are cast upon Uncle Fred's very young and vulnerable widow. It's written and directed by Rungano Nyoni. On Becoming a Guinea Fowl is in theaters now. So Bedatri, this was a movie that really caught me off guard, and I didn't know where it was going.

CHOUDHURY: Yes.

HARRIS: And I'm sure you kind of felt the same way. So, like, how did this hit you? What-- like, what were your initial thoughts with this movie?

CHOUDHURY: You know, I come from an Indian family. My parents have many siblings, and therefore, I have many cousins, which is kind of the setting in the film as well, right? So I--

HARRIS: Yeah.

CHOUDHURY: --immediately-- I mean, this is a hard film to-- and a weird film to say that I enjoyed it. But I felt it so deeply. And I think it's pretty much a universal emotion that, you know, when somebody in your family has passed away, there is a sense of grief. You're surrounded by grief all around you. Your mother is sad, which is always such a heartbreaking thing to witness. But also, you may or may not have very fond memories of this person who has passed. Or this person may have been a complex person, and you may not think very highly of them. And, you know, there-- that contradiction is something-- you know, when you have a big family, you have definitely faced that contradiction in your life, as have I. And I think, even though this is a diasporic African film set in Zambia, as you said, I could relate very strongly to this film.

HARRIS: Yes, I feel like anyone who comes from a family-- or a big family at all-- can definitely understand and relate in some ways. I also have a lot of cousins, so that--

CHOUDHURY: If you have more than five cousins, you will relate to this. [LAUGHS]

HARRIS: Absolutely, absolutely. Jourdain, you mentioned before we started taping, you're still processing this. But what-- how are you feeling about it?

SEARLES: You know, the thing that struck me the most was how funny it was.

HARRIS: Mm, yes. Absolutely.

SEARLES: I mean, even just, like, the beginning where they're just discovering the body, waiting in the car, and Shula is calling her dad-- [LAUGHS]

HARRIS: Yeah, yes.

SEARLES: But yeah, I mean, I have a Jamaican family, and it's interesting, just, like, watching stuff about families because I know that, like, when it comes to us, like, we don't really talk about anything that's uncomfortable. And so whenever we're all together, it's just everybody not saying anything. And so there are points when I was watching the movie where I thought about this one, like, lunch that we all had with me and my cousins, where we were just like, you know, the elders, like, we've never really hashed anything out. [LAUGHS]

CHOUDHURY: Yes, sounds familiar.

SEARLES: Yeah, I was-- and I was thinking about that so much while watching it, just all of us just being like, we could talk about this stuff. We just don't. And why is that? [LAUGHS]

HARRIS: Yeah. That is what this movie is about, right? It's this culture of silence and not feeling comfortable raising anything that might-- at one point, one of the characters says, like, I was afraid. I didn't want to break the family. Like, I was afraid to break the family. That just resonates so deeply. Like, it doesn't even have to be something as traumatic as what Shula and her cousins have experienced. It can be something just, like-- just someone who is very difficult or very complex to deal with, where it's like, you don't always say the quiet part out loud. While watching this, like, the first-- that opening scene, as you were saying, Jourdain, like, is so weird because Shula is also-- it took me a minute, but I realized that Shula is also dressed as Missy Elliott in the "I Can't Stand the Rain" video.

SEARLES: She sure is.

CHOUDHURY: Supa-dupa fly, yes. [LAUGHS]

HARRIS: Yeah, she's wearing that oversized, like, balloon suit.

SEARLES: Balloon suit. Yeah, yeah.

HARRIS: And then she has the helmet that's, like, rhinestone-encrusted and the glasses. And, like, they don't really explain it. At one point, she does say, like, I was coming from a party or something when I found his body, but it's just like, oh, sure, why not? And it's that sort of, like, weird, off-kilter way that Nyoni, the director, really kind of, like, taps into this sense of, like, this is going to be a familiar story, but it's going to be a familiar story that we tell in, like, a very, like, weird, surrealistic way. And I'm curious about, like, as the movie goes on, what did you make of the way the director kind of expands the world? And really kind of, like, we meet so many aunties, women in this family in passing. There's a lot of tradition here. So the women are inside the house. They all convene in one house, and the men are, like, outside. The women get to-- like, they are cooking. They are doing all the things they are inside, and they are mourning.

CHOUDHURY: There are also these very complex rituals of mourning and grieving within the family. Yes.

HARRIS: Yeah. So, like, what do you make of the fact that, like, we meet a lot of these women and aunties, but only in passing? And yet I still feel as though we get a sense of who, even if I don't catch their name-- like, it's hard to keep track of who's who-- like, I do get a sense of, like, what this community is like and how difficult it can be for Shula.

CHOUDHURY: Yeah, and then, you know, there's the obvious patriarchy of it all. And what, I think, one of the ways this film absolutely does an excellent job is showing how women are co-opted within the patriarchy, right? Like, you know, it's like, oh, how can I be a misogynist? I'm a woman, you know? And we've heard that so many times. I am a woman, too. As a woman, it shows that how, unfortunately, a lot of women from older generations-- and even our generation-- we are, like, co-opted into the patriarchy, and we pretty much become foot soldiers. Like you said, Aisha, the men are absolutely inept in this film. They don't do anything.

SEARLES: The dad asking for money. [LAUGHS]

CHOUDHURY: For money. Oh, my god.

HARRIS: Yes, yeah.

CHOUDHURY: But like, the meanest and the nastiest aunties and the things that they say and do, it's so difficult to watch. And you're like, oh, you know what? Like, this is what they know.

HARRIS: Yeah.

CHOUDHURY: It's heartbreaking. But like, we've all seen these instances of this in our society and mostly in our families where the widow is so young, and the uncle is a middle-aged man when he passes, when he dies. And the way she is treated by these, you know-- her sisters-in-law, is so stark. And again, like, of course, the director is, like, taking it to an extreme and playing it, like, you know-- taking it to the other side and, like, really amping it up. It's heartbreaking to see that. Right? But it is a reality. And another thing I'll say is like, you know, it's-- as Western audiences, it's very easy to say, oh, it's magical realism, you know, when anything is a little off-kilter and not standing by the three-act structure. But I am a little wary of using that word. But to Jourdain's point, it's so funny. It's so off-kilter and yet so dark. Again, a weird film to call a delight, but this film was such a delight.

SEARLES: Well, yeah. I mean, you talk about the way that the aunties are, and it's like, I did kind of think of them as a collective, the aunties. The aunties are doing something. [LAUGHS]

CHOUDHURY: The auntie chorus, yeah.

SEARLES: Yeah. They can be cruel, but they're so interesting. And through them, you know, you reveal kind of the entire situation of what's going on and also why Shula is the way that she is. Like, she's very, like, detached.

HARRIS: Yes.

SEARLES: She doesn't really emote very much. And you kind of get the sense that she's checked out emotionally because she knows what happens when you're emotionally invested. And she's like, no, I don't really want to do that. I just want to be able to--

CHOUDHURY: She's also shamed for it.

SEARLES: Yeah, right.

CHOUDHURY: Like, aren't you embarrassed that you can't cry at your uncle's funeral? Like, you know, there's-- yeah.

HARRIS: Yeah.

SEARLES: I mean, you understand the older women crying for him because, you know, they've known him so long. And also, there's all of these, like, you know, patriarchal considerations, and, oh, you know, he's probably not that bad. But then all of the younger people have a clearly different relationship to him.

CHOUDHURY: Yeah. It's like, actually, he is that bad and actually worse.

SEARLES: Yeah.

HARRIS: Yeah. Well, let's talk a little bit more about that, because I think we've been sort of, you know, dancing around it a little bit, but eventually it is revealed, if you couldn't tell already, that, like, Uncle Fred, like, sexually assaulted several of the women and girls in the family. I think it's really interesting to me the way that we see each of these characters process these things differently and find some of them don't feel comfortable speaking up and saying aloud what happened to them, or, like, re-saying those things aloud all the years after. But they find little ways to resist. Like, they're sitting-- at one point, they're kind of, like-- they're in the kitchen. Just, like, they lock the door, and they're like, no, we're not coming out to help. Like, there's little ways that they find. And I also just think the character of Nsansa, who is around-- it seems like she's around the same age as Shula. Bupe, the other cousin, is a little bit younger. But like, she is-- when we first meet her, she is this, like, very bawdy, brass-- brassy--

CHOUDHURY: Drunk.

HARRIS: --very drunk, like always drunk. Like, that's her thing.

SEARLES: She's great. I love her.

HARRIS: Elizabeth Chisela, who plays her, is just really fantastic. And we later on see the different layers that are kind of being, you know, pulled apart here as to why she's like this. And then Shula, as you mentioned, Jourdain, is very kind of, like, stoic. And just, like, even when she finds the dead body, she's just like-- it feels like more of an inconvenience to her than anything else. She's like, oh, really? She's like, I have to find the body?

SEARLES: I have to sit in this car, and I have to wait? Like, this--

HARRIS: Wait for the police to come?

CHOUDHURY: And again, like, down to the policemen, the men are so inept in this film.

HARRIS: I found that such a really interesting touch, is, like, these three characters, and then Bupe-- she's the youngest-- and we see her actually speak out. And then a character literally says, like, we are not going to speak of this, like, an elder. I just found that really, really fascinating. And I wonder what you think about where this stands in how film has managed to talk about sexual assault in different ways. I do think, like, at this point, we've seen a lot of really powerful and interesting depictions of this, mostly from female filmmakers. It feels familiar, but also different.

SEARLES: Yeah.

HARRIS: Did that strike you as well?

SEARLES: Well, there is definitely-- because I usually have-- watched a lot of films about sexual assault and trauma, and I wrote about them a lot when I was writing for Bitch Media. There's usually so much drama attached to it. And this is kind of different in the sense that it's about-- it's specifically about what we're not talking about. But you also get to see the effects. It's like, it's everything-- they're doing everything but overtly saying it. And it's kind of like, how, within this community, within these rituals, do we talk about it without, you know, going, I guess, like, kind of, like, full Western and just like, Western media and just being like, "this is what happens. Now everyone's crying," you know?

CHOUDHURY: Speaking of other films, Aisha, I was reminded of Mira Nair's Monsoon Wedding--

HARRIS: Ooh, yeah.

CHOUDHURY: --where there's a similar-- like, the niece-- it's a big Indian wedding, and the niece of the family actually says, I don't want to be a part of this wedding because there's this uncle who abused me as a child. And then there's huge drama, and there's the same idea that you're breaking up the family. What are you doing? This is a happy occasion. I love that film because at the end of it, the patriarch of the family asks this uncle to leave and says, my daughters are everything for me, and please leave. It reminded me of that, and it reminded me of Monsoon Wedding also because of the class question. It is very important here to note that Chichi is young and poor--

HARRIS: Right. And Chichi is Fred's widow.

CHOUDHURY: --and, like, needs Fred's money to survive. And she has, like, six kids, and she's very, very young.

HARRIS: Yeah.

CHOUDHURY: And Fred clearly belongs to this family that's, like, upper class. They have this big house. They're hosting all these people for the funeral. And by the end of it, they refuse to give her any money. So I also think the director does a fantastic job of complicating this and bringing in the question of class, saying, yeah, he probably-- of course, being a man in this society affords him this privilege, but also the fact that he's a rich man means that he can keep doing this and getting away with it, beyond his family as well.

HARRIS: Yeah. And to that point, the fact that he was even able to marry someone so much younger reinforces sort of this idea that the family is OK with these things happening, you know? Granted, I don't think Shula even knew he had a widow. It's not clear how many people knew he was married, which is strange [LAUGHS] because he has, like, a whole family.

SEARLES: Yeah.

HARRIS: Nyoni is someone who I'm definitely now like, I'm going to seek out anything she does because she just has, like, this hold and this understanding of what it means-- like, what these limitations are for women even in modern-day times, and how women help to uphold patriarchy, in many ways. And she isn't afraid to say that. And she's just, like, a really dynamic filmmaker. There are a lot of shots, including the final shot in this film, On Becoming a Guinea Fowl, that is just like--

CHOUDHURY: Oh, my god, yeah.

HARRIS: --really, really powerful. I don't know. I want to close by asking you all, you know-- this doesn't quite end in the same way that Monsoon Wedding does. You know, what do you make of the fact that it doesn't quite go the way I think most, at least Western, audiences may think it does or should?

SEARLES: You know, as we were talking about the film, it made me realize that the ways in which, like, the ending is unsatisfying, kind of, makes perfect sense for what the film is trying to do. So I kind of, like, worked it out while we were talking.

HARRIS: Oh, OK.

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CHOUDHURY: Glad to be of service.

HARRIS: Yeah. [LAUGHS]

SEARLES: But I mean, the ending, there's a sense of catharsis, but there's also-- it's also a little unsatisfying. And I think that that's-- I think that that works for it.

CHOUDHURY: I love that this world is really not a place for women, and therefore, we should seek out these other planes of existence. I love that idea. But also, you know, the film is called On Becoming a Guinea Fowl. And it kind of-- again, not saying too much. The ending kind of speaks to that name, that why is-- why does it have that name, you know. And guinea fowls, in the animal kingdom, which are seen-- and the film tells us-- they actually-- their call is like a call of caution to other animals. They call out when there are predators around. And they call out so that the other animals near them know that there are predators around, and they can save themselves and protect themselves. So I think, you know, all of this coming together in that last scene, again, it's not satisfying, like Jourdain says, but it doesn't have to. It just leaves you with all of these things to deal with.

SEARLES: It leaves you with a lot to think about.

HARRIS: Well, I think I'll be thinking about this movie for a very long time, and I hope people who are listening, if you haven't seen it already, you should absolutely seek it out so then you can think about it as well.

CHOUDHURY: Please. Absolutely, yes.

HARRIS: And maybe even talk to your friends about it and then process it in the same way that all three of us were able to do here.

SEARLES: Yeah. Yeah.

HARRIS: So let us know what you think about On Becoming a Guinea Fowl. Find us on Facebook at facebook.com/pchh and on Letterboxd at letterboxd.com/nprpopculture. We will have a link to that in our episode description. That brings us to the end of our show. Jourdain Searles, Bedatri Choudhury, thanks so much for being here. This was a pleasure.

CHOUDHURY: Absolutely. Thank you so much.

SEARLES: Thanks so much. Always have a good time.

HARRIS: This episode was produced by Hafsa Fathima and edited by Jessica Reedy and Mike Katzif. We had audio engineering assistance from Cena Loffredo. And Hello Come In provides our theme music. Thank you for listening to Pop Culture Happy Hour from NPR. I'm Aisha Harris. We'll see you all next time.

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